Author Topic: RiddleZ! (Read 911 times)

Tollison · « **Reply #15 on:** September 24, 2013, 07:46:34 am »

The first two modes were easy. This is why I directly went to God Slayer mode.

God Slayer Mode: You don't know which bird is which and can't make a hypothetical statement such as, "which door matches your attribute." 1 bird tells you its door A then you either take its word for it or choose the other door. Your answer will be random, but it will be based on your judgement of the bird. If I hear that there is 1 liar of 2 then I don't find that group trustworthy so I'm going to choose the other door.

Your answer to God Slayer mode is. "what door matches your attribute." You have to assume that their attribute matches where the door leads. Heaven and Hell can be either truthful or false. There is no implication in the problem where it says Heaven is a trustworthy place and Hell isn't.

Therefore the bird would instead ask you, "which attribute" instead of leading you to your desired pathway; leaving you to randomly choose which door you open.

XXXandBEER · « **Reply #16 on:** September 24, 2013, 08:28:38 am »

Some people don't know how to use spoilers in this thread...

But let's make this a bit harder what if both the birds think they are telling the truth? MIND BLOWN

Chakra · « **Reply #17 on:** September 24, 2013, 09:34:24 am »

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can't make a hypothetical statement such as, "which door matches your attribute."

That's not a hypothetical statement. "What door would you go to if you died" is.

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Your answer to God Slayer mode is. "what door matches your attribute." You have to assume that their attribute matches where the door leads. Heaven and Hell can be either truthful or false. There is no implication in the problem where it says Heaven is a trustworthy place and Hell isn't.

The "What door matches your attribute," is the generic question style, not what the question specifically is. I went with it because it was simple/easy to understand. A more proper question would be like: "Your defining trait of lying or truth telling would Biblically match which door?"

I stopped using spoilers after Amir decided the question solved.

Chiefhero[sks] · « **Reply #18 on:** September 24, 2013, 03:38:54 pm »

Quote from: tollison

If I hear that there is 1 liar of 2 then I don't find that group trustworthy so I'm going to choose the other door.

it makes just as much sense to find the group trustworthy and go with whatever door they tell you (there is also 1/2 truthtellers ^^)

Quote from: tollison

Heaven and Hell can be either truthful or false. There is no implication in the problem where it says Heaven is a trustworthy place and Hell isn't.

the riddle assumes that you know what heaven and hell stands for in 99.999999999% of litterature, as well as in the minds of 99.99999999% of people who believe in heaven/hell.

chakra just posted a variant of the "matches your attribute" solution. you can phrase it differently(like i did), but it's basically the same solution.

but either way tollison, your 'optimal solution' is identical to making a blind guess (50% chance of being right).

which door leads to heaven (truthbird) -> the heavens door
which door leads to heaven (falsebird) -> the hells door

taking the opposite door will lead you to hell half of the time you run the experiment (you don't know which bird is which obviously). it's not 2/3 chance of being right. it doesn't make more sense to act as if both birds lie than acting as if both birds tell the truth (50% chance of being right with both assumptions).

unless you show how the proposed answers from enstek/chakra give you less than 50% chance of being right, it would seem like you've posted the worst solution thus far (identical to making a blind guess, yet more hassle to go through).

Tollison · « **Reply #19 on:** September 24, 2013, 08:58:01 pm »

Chakra, you're assuming that Heaven is a trustworthy place. It's hypothetical to accept something as truth when you have no proof.

"Your defining trait of lying or truth telling would Biblically match which door?" is also hypothetical. You're assuming the bird knows about all the bibles. The heaven you're trying to go to isn't a specified Heaven. The bird will answer, "What do you mean by biblically" leaving you with no more questions and leaving you to guess which door to open.

Just because 99.99999999% accept Heaven as a trustworthy place doesn't make it factually trustworthy nor should it be implied by reading the riddle. If the riddle is to be answered there should be no misunderstanding of what's going on.

XXXandBEER · « **Reply #20 on:** September 25, 2013, 12:29:42 am »

Quote from: Tollison on September 24, 2013, 08:58:01 pm

Chakra, you're assuming that Heaven is a trustworthy place. It's hypothetical to accept something as truth when you have no proof.

"Your defining trait of lying or truth telling would Biblically match which door?" is also hypothetical. You're assuming the bird knows about all the bibles. The heaven you're trying to go to isn't a specified Heaven. The bird will answer, "What do you mean by biblically" leaving you with no more questions and leaving you to guess which door to open.

Just because 99.99999999% accept Heaven as a trustworthy place doesn't make it factually trustworthy nor should it be implied by reading the riddle. If the riddle is to be answered there should be no misunderstanding of what's going on.

That's what I'm saying what if both the birds think they are telling the truth?

Chakra · « **Reply #21 on:** September 25, 2013, 05:58:44 am »

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Just because 99.99999999% accept Heaven as a trustworthy place doesn't make it factually trustworthy nor should it be implied by reading the riddle.

Everyone else knew what the riddle meant and implied. Heaven doesn't exist; the riddle stipulates it does and that Heaven is associated with truth-telling.

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That's what I'm saying what if both the birds think they are telling the truth?

They don't.

You all need to take some social classes if you can't pick up on the implications that Heaven is associated with truth-telling, and definitely so in this riddle (and Amir saying I answered it PROVES this) and that the birds are omniscient.

Tollison · « **Reply #22 on:** September 25, 2013, 02:42:14 pm »

Chakra, you believe in Heaven. About 2/3 of the human population believe in a heaven therefore the belief in God is widespread and implied for us all to believe it. Your life stipulates that it does and Heaven is associated with your belief.

It seems your becoming ignorant of your own faith, Chakra. Your explanations are very faith based. You would make a great Christian, Chakra.

Chiefhero[sks] · « **Reply #23 on:** September 25, 2013, 03:04:09 pm »

lol ^^

yeee maybe tollison is right tho? shouldn't have to assume anything when solving the riddle.

still dont understand how tollisons solution is ideal tho.

Chakra · « **Reply #24 on:** September 25, 2013, 06:16:57 pm »

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Chakra, you believe in Heaven.

No I don't.

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Your life stipulates that it does

What is "my life"? Like... those around me? Nope: my entire family is agnostic, as well as a great majority of my friends.

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If you break me
I do not stop working,
If you touch me
I may be snared,
If you lose me
Nothing will matter.

A classic riddle. Problem is it assumes that the heart can think, thus it's unsolvable!!!!

Tollison · « **Reply #25 on:** September 25, 2013, 08:18:59 pm »

Not going to refute me on assuming what the riddle implies anymore, Chakra?

Easy and God mode are understood as solved, but God Slayer mode requires assumptions to solve it. God Slayer mode = can't find out which door to open unless you imply that Heaven is trustworthy in the riddle.

My solution isn't ideal, Amir. Sorry about that. I was expressing a personal opinion on how to make the 50/50 decision ><

XXXandBEER · « **Reply #26 on:** September 26, 2013, 02:22:39 am »

Even bad guys think they are doing the "Right" thing so whose to say both the birds think they are telling the truth.

Chakra · « **Reply #27 on:** September 26, 2013, 02:53:43 am »

The riddle assumes birds can understand English and that they speak English (or at least a language you know).

All parts require assumptions.

Tollison · « **Reply #28 on:** September 26, 2013, 05:45:24 am »

There are birds that can understand and speak English, but there isn't a Heaven for us to view.

Chakra · « **Reply #29 on:** September 26, 2013, 06:20:36 am »

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There are birds that can understand and speak English

No there aren't.

Saying parrots speak English is like saying this vbs script knows English:

Code: [Select]

stuff = LCase(InputBox("Speak"))

If InStr(stuff, "heaven") Then
	MsgBox("Take the door to your left.")
ElseIf InStr(stuff, "hell") Then
	MsgBox("Take the door to your right.")
End If

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Author Topic: RiddleZ! (Read 911 times)

Tollison

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XXXandBEER

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Chakra

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Chiefhero[sks]

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Tollison

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XXXandBEER

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Tollison

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Chakra

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Tollison

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