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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 05:05:31 am


Title: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 05:05:31 am
Americans have #1 best social location in the world.  The best opportunities of all people in the world and we have the best military.

Americans are generally English speakers as well, the most expressive language in the world!

Our customs are great too.  One arms distance from each other most of the time, handshakes, expressions, etc.

We basically bully each other to keep each other as top dogs in the worldly community.  Everywhere we go we get MAD respect.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Shyamora[SkS] on September 29, 2013, 11:55:52 am
Yeah.. I see no reason to even start debating on this because there's a shitload of pro and con arguments that it's way to tiring to get into.
Besides, Americans are essentially Europeans.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Map on September 29, 2013, 03:28:49 pm
Negative:
1.gun law: kids shooting eachother, more crime.
2. political issues
3. arrogance towards the rest of the world
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Shyamora[SkS] on September 29, 2013, 04:07:12 pm
4. Obesity
5. Criminal rates in general
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 06:00:13 pm
K so youve listed some negatives, but I don't see any of you posting what is more positive about your countries ^^.  You feel inferior to USA or what?
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 08:00:35 pm
Quote
The best opportunities of all people in the world
How do you make this claim?

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c7/Intergenerational_mobility_graph-1.jpg)
This shows that, in the US (and UK), if you are born poor, you're greatly more likely to die poor.

Nearly on every dimension we consider positive, such as education, health care affordability, infrastructure, the US is getting further and further behind. One of the only things we are still relatively good at is median income.

I'd much rather have been born in Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Sweden, etc etc.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: HaWkys on September 29, 2013, 08:37:26 pm
Chakra, More people are on the waiting list to get into the US than any other country.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 08:59:26 pm
That's cool. Per capita we aren't near the top, though.
(http://i.imgur.com/T5UeE35.png)

Per Capita, Libya and Qatar has over nine times more migrants than the US. Zimbabwe over six.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 09:05:44 pm
Most of the poor that become rich happen in the US.  http://www.businessinsider.com/formerly-homeless-people-who-became-famous-2012-6?op=1

There's more opportunity in the US to become RICH even if you're POOR :D.

So, Chakra, do you have an opinion of which is the best country or not?  If not then get out of the thread.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 09:25:29 pm
Your evidence of poor people becoming rich is an article that with 11 people? That's an entire 0.000035%!!! Such mobility!!!

In the US, your chance of success/failure (economically) is determined 50% by your parents' wealth. In Denmark it's 15%. You seriously think individuals have greater opportunity in the US?

Basically any north western European country is better than the US. For the sake of argument, though, I'll pick Iceland.

Iceland ranks 12th in Education (US 13th), 8th in inequality-adjusted HDI (US 16th), a perfect Freedom House ranking (same as US), 11th in corruption (US 19th), and 1st in peace (US 99th).
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 09:33:22 pm
A terrorist country could squash Iceland easily.  Not much protection there.

Your argument that Iceland is better is invalid.  Their social location doesn't matter if it can't be protected efficiently ^^.

The US, though, can't be defeated :D
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 09:37:07 pm
US is being defeated by Walmart and Goldman Sachs. You are a slave to your corporate overlords and think your military makes your country great. You feel that an Orwellian surveillance state is a good idea because of the invisible terrorist threat.

Military doesn't stop terrorism. Look at India. Look at Indonesia. Terrorism is caused by intolerance and corruption, something the US excels at.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 09:46:16 pm
The US isn't being attacked by those two institutions.

Your argument is invalid.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 09:47:19 pm
Iceland isn't being attacked by terrorists.

Your argument is invalid.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 09:49:16 pm
Icelands defense < US defense

My argument is valid.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 09:52:34 pm
US has much greater military defense, yet ranks 99th in peacefulness while Iceland is at 1st. :D

Ye US! Where you randomly get shot on the street, but at least we won't get attacked by some country we've bombed a thousand times!

Edit: The US, where you are eight times more likely to be killed by the police than a terrorist. :D (http://www.policymic.com/articles/37775/you-re-8x-more-likely-to-be-killed-by-a-police-officer-than-a-terrorist)
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 10:02:25 pm
The US, a place where you don't have to worry about mass invasions and can protect yourself from police and criminals efficiently, and you have more of a say than any country as to where you can live :D.  All you have to do is want it and BAM you can get it.

US > Iceland still in opportunity and being greater overall country.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 10:22:23 pm
Quote
where you don't have to worry about mass invasions
Icelandic people don't worry about invasions. Who's going to invade them? The US? ^^ Why would you invade Iceland? Can't export their energy.

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protect yourself from police and criminals efficiently
If this was true, why are Americans so much more likely to be killed by police and criminals than most other developed countries?
(http://i.imgur.com/yrFe5nk.png)

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you have more of a say than any country as to where you can live
Do you mean like.. climate? If so, I agree. US probably has most varied climate for living. But leaving/entering the country is obviously not as free as it is in the Schengen area.

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opportunity
It was already proved that the greatest determiner of success is the wealth of your parents in the US. No one in their right mind calls it "opportunity" if the conditions of your success is dependent on your parents.

Quote from: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/post/why-us-economic-mobility-is-so-low-in-one-chart/2011/11/17/gIQA4IFpUN_blog.html
A new report from the Pew Economic Mobility Project zeroes in on one major factor: In America there’s a stronger link between parents’ education levels and children’s success than in any other country researchers investigated.
The report notes the size of the achievement gap: “In the United States, children with high-educated parents scored in the 73rd percentile on average, compared with children who have low-educated parents and tended to score in the 27th percentile.” The report concludes that other countries have more successful policies and institutions that have helped close this achievement gap, giving children from less-educated families a greater chance of success.

As I don't have stats for Iceland, you can't conclude the US has greater opportunity. All we know is it has less opportunity than most of Western Europe. ^^

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greater overall country
By what criteria? We've already found that the US scores worse in education, peace, happiness, opportunity, etc. Only thing the US tops at is believers in angels and prison population.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 29, 2013, 10:29:20 pm
Read up on your history, Chakra.  From the birth of all these civilizations to now.

Which country has the most successors of poor social locations?  You guessed it right, the USA baby :D

Examples aren't needed to be given.  You can look that up yourself.  You should know this.

BTW, if you live in the US you can choose your social location.  It's just a matter of trying to get there is your pathway.  Those that choose to not go towards a social location = most likely won't get there.

If Iceland is so great, Chakra, then why don't you live there?  You're allowed to go.  Oh thats right!! You have more opportunity in the USA :DDD
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 29, 2013, 10:40:12 pm
Quote
Which country has the most successors of poor social locations?
I don't argue the US was never the best country to live, I argue it is not today. The past proof of the current. I've proven you have more opportunity at economic success in other countries than in the US. You have only made unverified/unverifiable claims.

I imagine when looking at raw numbers of poor people who have become rich, the area with the most people would be Africa, by virtue of people being there for millions of years.

Quote
Examples aren't needed to be given.  You can look that up yourself.  You should know this.
IE, "I don't need evidence, I just make random bull**** claims."

Quote
if you live in the US you can choose your social location.  It's just a matter of trying to get there is your pathway.  Those that choose to not go towards a social location = most likely won't get there.
So you're saying that if you are poor and want to become rich, you can do it in the US? Then why is there so low economic mobility? Everyone in the US just likes being poor, not having healthcare, etc? So basically Americans are just less motivated than those from Denmark?

Your motivation for success is directly tied to your socio-economic status in America. If you are poor, you live in a ghetto, your family is less likely to push you to achieve something, your neighborhood encourages you to not succeed, you go to horrible schools, etc. Sure, if you are truly motivated to succeed, you may have a high chance at it (note, not becoming super rich, but wealthy), but this is true anywhere. The problem is everywhere else you are more likely to have the motivation to succeed.

There are multiple reasons I remain in the US. The biggest is I've already made countries in my city: I have family, friends, boyfriend, etc. I'd have to start over if I moved. Second, I was born in an anglosphere country, meaning I know English, are accustomed to anglosphere customs, etc. I'd have to adjust to a Norse country.

Your rate of success is tied to your connections. I am already somewhere on the chain of success in the US, while in Iceland I'd start with only my non-complete anglo education.

That being said, if my BF wanted to, I'd gladly move to the Oceanic region once our education is complete. More likely we'll move to California, though, as that's where his job prospects are best, and mine are unrelated to region.


Edit: BtW, Iceland is about as secure as the US, because it's part of NATO, and the US promises to protect NATO members. :)
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Perry_Hewbes on September 29, 2013, 11:29:10 pm
Lol Tolli getting CRUSHED  by Chakra. I guess not that big of a surprise.

But tolli, first you start off with threads about love/prosperity and the origins of hate... now this? You realize this is in the Hate category? I hate to gang up on you, but EVEN IF you won argument with chakra... Why brag and boost yourself for being superior and put down/laugh at the rest? This is like making fun of the fat kid in gym class.
No country is even close to perfect, including USA. But there is no doubt USA is one of the better countries on earth. Why make fun out of **** like kids dying of starvation at the age of 7 in Africa? This is all i hear from you:

"hurhur we are da bezt, luuk africuh dey cant eben feed dur kids hurhur, da moeny i spended on gas dis week is moer den taht kiddo in africA spent on fo0d in lifetiem DURHURBDUR we r so much bettur"

"HUrhur we haz bezt rate of homelesS 2 rich ppl in americuh cuz we HAZ Moast homelesS ppl... see iz dur no reeson wai we not bestest? Homelesz pplz gettin' dem goald teeths rite now aHurrr"

'MURRICA #1
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Shyamora[SkS] on September 29, 2013, 11:34:22 pm
Some statistics:

Granted, this is from 2001, but I reckon it hasn't become much better since then, if not worse.
[img]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Social-expenditures-2001-OCSE.png/800px-Social-expenditures-2001-OCSE.png[img]
This map shows the social expenditures of ones GDP. In other words what one DOESNT pay on healthcare, taxes, insurance etc.

You have high education, but 53% of your college graduates under 25 years old is unemployed.
http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/53-percent-of-all-young-college-graduates-in-america-are-either-unemployed-or-underemployed

In 6 years times, you have climbed from 10% to 30% in unemployed people who've been workless for more than 52 weeks

People are unable to pay their bills on time, or are negligent in this. One out of three Americans doesn't pay on time.
http://heraldnews.suntimes.com/business/11698828-420/one-in-three-americans-paying-bills-late-survey.html

Your student loan problem is GIGANTIC. Besides, it's growing rapidly.
http://www.consumerfinance.gov/blog/too-big-to-fail-student-debt-hits-a-trillion/

Your median income is one of the highest, granted. Still you pay shitloads of healthcare while countries like Sweden, Norway and Austria have this completely for free. Besides, your median income, one of the few things you do rank very high in, is dropping. In the last six years you've decreased by 7.4%.
http://economy.money.cnn.com/2012/03/06/economy-improves-incomes-dont/

In the year 2000, 21% of the money 'earned' in the US was 'hand-out' money. Social welfare benefits. Nowadays, that is 35%, people cannot sustain themselves so the government is creating money, so that they can hand it out and say the US isn't going to ****?
http://www.cnbc.com/id/41969508

The poorest 50% of your population owns only 2.5% of the wealth in the USA. Talk about social inequalty. Yea, you can make it big in the US (though Chakra mentioned that's the same everywhere, which is completely true) but you're more likely to end up in slums in the US than in bloody India.
http://www.businessinsider.com/facts-about-inequality-in-america-2011-11#half-of-america-owns-25-of-countrys-wealth-the-top-1-owns-a-third-of-it-2

Since 1970, the dollar has inflated enormously. It is now worth 83% less than before. Yea you're making a lot of money, but you won't be able to buy much with it. This is slowly going down the Zimbabwan dollars way.
http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/archives/inflation-is-a-tax-and-the-federal-reserve-is-taxing-the-living-daylights-out-of-us

Every minute, the US national debt is increasing by 2 million dollars. And you currently have a total of $16,738,443,175,473.97 of debt.. almost 17 trillion dollars man.
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/debt/current

I'm not saying which country is best, I'm certainly saying that the USA is not even NEAR the best.
Good luck refuting mate.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 12:06:58 am
I can't refute anything you have just said

But USA is still the best country to live in, and Americans are destroying this very countrys greatness and most Americans have no clue how it's happening.  All of those statistics are quite irrelevant.  We still have #1 opportunity reguardless of where we come from to become the most successful individuals the world can produce.

Hopefully we'll stop meddling in foreign military occupations and instead come protect our borders from terrorism instead of trying to defeat it at it's source which is impossible to do because terrorism comes from thought.

The people of USA are the biggest problem.  Very uneducated about their own political system.  It will take the American public to make America greater than it already is.

If no one has a stronger opinion about the USA in favor of another country then get out of the thread.  If you can't make a better comparison of a greater country then you have no valid argument.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: XXXandBEER on September 30, 2013, 12:09:54 am
****
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 12:42:31 am
I got much lower chance of dying young in Iceland, so Iceland is best country in world!!!
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 12:45:54 am
Iceland = bigger chance of being blown off the face of the Earth.

USA BEST COUNTRY IN THE WORLD :D
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: HaWkys on September 30, 2013, 01:10:53 am
Chakra, AIDS follows you no matter where you go :D
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 01:13:35 am
Who cares about being blown off the face of the Earth? It's still being killed and... Icelandics got much lower chance of being killed!!!

Well, we made it to the second page without any progress, so maybe we can formalize the debate a bit more?

To compare two things, we need criteria, else everything is subjective. What makes a country a great place to live? What makes it bad?

I argue that these are the most important factors:


What are your criteria, Tolli?
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: HaWkys on September 30, 2013, 01:17:55 am
Chakra i was hoping for some smart remark back, but i just got ignored. Ouch that hurt
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 01:30:01 am
The same as yours, Chakra.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 02:25:30 am
OK, so for socioeconomic mobility between generations I get:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c7/Intergenerational_mobility_graph-1.jpg)

Life expectancy rates show the US is behind OECD countries while Iceland is greatly ahead, especially at birth (high infant mortality in the US).
(http://i.imgur.com/XzdfFJu.png)

Meanwhile health care costs are growing at faster rates (of already much higher costs) in the US compared to OCED, and more-so compared to Iceland.
(http://i.imgur.com/HipS8Ap.png)

A lot more Icelandic children are enrolled into education than Americans.
(http://i.imgur.com/OPtbinq.png)

Poor people in Iceland have a ~70% chance of going to college while it's only ~30% in America.
(http://i.imgur.com/suJ9HV6.png)

Peacefulness isn't really even a comparison. Iceland ranks as the most peaceful country in the world while the US is 99th. This takes into account many factors: perceived criminality, number of security officers & police, homicides, incarcerated population, access to weapons, organized conflict, violent demonstrations, violent crime, political instability, political terror, weapon importations, terrorist activities, death from conflicts, military expenditures, army size, UN peacekeeping funding, nuclear/heavy weapons, displaced people, relations to neighboring countries, and current conflicts.
(http://i.imgur.com/Jj5WQy3.png)

On every measurement, Iceland ranks better than the US. To claim the US is a better place to live than Iceland is to be anti-number.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 02:35:26 am
Socioeconomic mobility between generations (opportunity). - The biggest gaps have been overcome through Americans, not people from Iceland ^^.  We also still gold that ability to this day.  If we keep going down the path we are going right now economically we could lose that privilege :D.  This alone makes America > Iceland.
Access to healthcare.  -  We have access to healthcare AND access to work to provide ourselves with healthcare.  The people that are out of work aren't trying hard enough to find it.
Access to quality education.  - Got that.  Individuals just need to apply themselves to go to it and apply it.
Freedom from physical harm (including death).  -  We have the right to bear arms, and those that brake the law must be punished, therefore it isn't the US as a whole country that isn't protecting us from physical harm, but the people themselves are naively not protecting themselves.

Next.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 02:44:06 am
Quote
Socioeconomic mobility between generations (opportunity). - The biggest gaps have been overcome through Americans, not people from Iceland ^^.  We also still gold that ability to this day.  If we keep going down the path we are going right now economically we could lose that privilege :D.  This alone makes America > Iceland.
Zero evidence of this.

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Access to healthcare.  -  We have access to healthcare AND access to work to provide ourselves with healthcare.  The people that are out of work aren't trying hard enough to find it.
Access includes how easy it is. Easier to get good healthcare in Iceland than in the US.

Quote
Access to quality education.  - Got that.  Individuals just need to apply themselves to go to it and apply it.
Good education costs money. Good luck if you're poor!~~~~

Quote
Freedom from physical harm (including death).  -  We have the right to bear arms, and those that brake the law must be punished, therefore it isn't the US as a whole country that isn't protecting us from physical harm, but the people themselves are naively not protecting themselves.
Cool in theory. In actuality you get shot a lot less in Iceland than in the US.

Next.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 02:52:15 am
lots of evidence.  You just have to do some research.  I don't have to show you statistics to be right ^^

Access to healthcare is easy.  Work for it.

Good education does cost money, so work for it.

Both the US and Iceland have the right to bare arms.  Why do you think Iceland is so safe? :D

The U.S. is just full of immoral people who commit crimes.  If the people of the US world strengthen their moral standards then there would be less crime.  Bringing up whether you are more liable to be shot in America isn't relevant to the whole country.  It is only relevant to the areas of which it is relevant.

NEXT.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 03:05:08 am
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lots of evidence.  You just have to do some research.  I don't have to show you statistics to be right ^^
I did some research, and the evidence is agaisnt you.

Quote
Access to healthcare is easy.  Work for it.

Good education does cost money, so work for it.
So you agree there is greater access to healthcare and education in Iceland. Thank you.

Quote
Both the US and Iceland have the right to bare arms.  Why do you think Iceland is so safe? :D

The U.S. is just full of immoral people who commit crimes.  If the people of the US world strengthen their moral standards then there would be less crime.  Bringing up whether you are more liable to be shot in America isn't relevant to the whole country.  It is only relevant to the areas of which it is relevant.
You said, "Americans are the best race thus far," not "Texans," or "Californians." The facts are simple: you are less likely to get shot in Iceland. You seem to be arguing Icelandic people are more moral, that's just a positive in my favor.

So far you are losing on socioeconomic mobility, have agreed there is greater access to healthcare and education in Iceland, and agreed that Icelandic people are more physically secure. Yet you still argue the US is better why?
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 03:11:16 am
Hell no it isn't.  America is still #1 if you want opportunity.  There are more poor to rich success stories coming out of USA than Iceland :D

Greater access to healthcare in Iceland?  Hell no lol.  America has the best medical facilities you just gotta work for it to get inside of them.  Quit being a lazy, chakra.

Americans ARE THE BEST RACE THUS FAR!  We just need to arm ourselves like Iceland does instead of being panzies.  Americans shouldn't be unarmed panzies!!!  Morals of America are at an all time low, but there are still good, hard working Americans like me that are willing to educate those that don't understand how acquiring healthcare, and benefits works.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Exa on September 30, 2013, 03:14:59 am
Knocked out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h__uutzcQXc
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Chakra on September 30, 2013, 03:17:22 am
Quote
Hell no it isn't.  America is still #1 if you want opportunity.  There are more poor to rich success stories coming out of USA than Iceland
That's because America has a thousand times more people. Per capita, however, Iceland has "more poor to rich success stories."

Quote
Greater access to healthcare in Iceland?  Hell no lol.  America has the best medical facilities you just gotta work for it to get inside of them.  Quit being a lazy, chakra.
You apparently don't know what the word access means. We aren't talking about "best healthcare facilities in the world," we're talking about, "a means of approaching or entering a place" of healthcare.
Healthcare costs are 52.27% less in Iceland than they are in the US.

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Americans ARE THE BEST RACE THUS FAR!  We just need to arm ourselves like Iceland does instead of being panzies.  Americans shouldn't be unarmed panzies!!!
So you continue to agree Iceland does better on physical security.

Iceland still beats the US on all four categories previously agreed upon.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Tollison on September 30, 2013, 03:24:42 am
America isn't the greatest country anymore.  Exas video moved me deeply..

I still want to become a great elected official of the United States and make it prosper though :D
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: XXXandBEER on October 01, 2013, 11:28:03 pm
America is the best place because even though Chakra is American he is still routing against it. We have the most broad ranged group of citizens where half of them like Chakra could careless about the country whereas the other half love the country. It is quite an astounding country you don't get that kind of diversity anywhere else.
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Shoop on October 02, 2013, 12:08:09 am
Lol, what do you base that on BEER?

You have 2 extremly similar political parties in USA. In Sweden we have 8 only in the parlament, and you talk about diversity lol...
Title: Re: Americans are the best race thus far
Post by: Alph4bet on October 02, 2013, 04:45:16 am
Chakra won that argument by page 2 and then reaffirmed the position at the start of page 3. Tollison just couldn't understand the simple points that Chakra had stated backed with statistical proof. The only question I'd ask chakra when he provided such proof is: What were his sources? :p

Just because you haven't heard of "Rich to poor success stories" in other countries Tolli, doesn't mean they don't exist, the only reason I in Australia would hear anything to do with America would be because I research that aspect myself on American news websites. Or because they are in movies/Television Series/documentries mass produced by America. When was the last time you went on an Iceland News Website? lol

Anyway, good debate up until Tollison argued a point without understanding what was said. Very patient of Chakra for sticking with it, making him understand, lol as per usual when I was getting him to tutor me on basic math LOL(I hadn't studied math in two years and needed his help with the Elo Ladder system), Patient!

Edit: Grammatical Error